New maps

Faults and Technical chat for the Seat Ateca
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pch
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:05 pm

New maps

Post by pch » Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:31 pm

Few days ago noticed new maps are available. They are dated May 2017 but I'm pretty sure I've checked mid June and latest were Nov 2016.

Anyway... downloaded them, unpacked to the card but in the car they are not available.

Upon inserting getting message that detected navigation card, then checking for few moments, finally that maps are not available.

Unpacked old maps to the card and it worked fine.
Bought a new card, unpacked to it and again - new maps don't work, old do.

Have you checked new maps yet? Do they work for you?


jamesiow
Posts: 197
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:24 pm
Location: South of England

Re: New maps

Post by jamesiow » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:06 pm

I think in the UK you cannot simply download maps to the card they have to be coded at the dealer... in Europe they have a service called 'map care' which is a subscription service which allows updates of the maps. seemed a very sensible approach unfortunately VW AG UK do not seem all that sensible in their approach to their customers is a good way to get in excess of £100 out of us.... do not think it is really necessary after one or two years but after three or four, or if the government to follow through with their promise of building lots of new roads it would be worthwhile
ATECA SE 1.0 Technology, Petrol, Manual, Samoa Orange, Park Assist, Convenience Pack, Top view camera with rear view camera, Electric Tailgate with Virtual Pedal & Keyless Entry.


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pch
Posts: 79
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Re: New maps

Post by pch » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:18 pm

I'm based in Ireland and I was told at dealership that updates are downloadable from the internet. I paid about 80 euro for updates, however I don't know how it works as the download link is public for all (found it somewhere in this forum).

Strangely, upon collection there were no maps installed at all. After a week I reported this to dealer and got sealed-new SD card few days later. The card was write-protected and worked from the first insert so definitely there were no coding nor pairing.


jamesiow
Posts: 197
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 9:24 pm
Location: South of England

Re: New maps

Post by jamesiow » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:20 pm

pch wrote:
Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:18 pm
I'm based in Ireland and I was told at dealership that updates are downloadable from the internet. I paid about 80 euro for updates, however I don't know how it works as the download link is public for all (found it somewhere in this forum).

Strangely, upon collection there were no maps installed at all. After a week I reported this to dealer and got sealed-new SD card few days later. The card was write-protected and worked from the first insert so definitely there were no coding nor pairing.
That's interesting I would have thought they have the same as UK maps via mr dealer on SEAT SD card and locked to card/car....
ATECA SE 1.0 Technology, Petrol, Manual, Samoa Orange, Park Assist, Convenience Pack, Top view camera with rear view camera, Electric Tailgate with Virtual Pedal & Keyless Entry.


loffler
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:52 pm

Re: New maps

Post by loffler » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:06 am

The website is for Mapcare customers only. In UK you have to buy a new card each time.
The SD card is locked to the car on first use using the CID number of the card (unique hard coded number that cant be changed). Your new card cant be used in any other car now and cant be updated simply by overwriting the map files as there are encrypted files unique to your car.

There are ways emerging to get new maps by spoofing the CID number on certain hackable SD cards or copying encrypted files over but its a lot of work and effort just to stay up to date! I never updated the maps in my Leon for 6 years and never had an issue.
Jungle Green 1.4 EcoTSi DSG Xcellence
Heated Windscreen and Virtual Pedal
Ordered 3rd Feb - Delivered 24th Apr


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pch
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:05 pm

Re: New maps

Post by pch » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:24 am

I'm not getting that.
1. How the website knows I'm Mapcare user - there is no login or so. Just plain link. Everyone can download new maps.
2. How CID can be stored on the card when card is write-protected? It's a mechanical switch which cannot be overridden.
3. I compared all files and their contend from my SD card with files downloadable (ver Nov '16) and all of them were the same which means there were not modified by CID encryption.
4. Instruction to update clearly states procedure: wipe the card and unpack new files.

Even if somehow magically car is able to ignore physical write-lock switch the card is still linked to my car but new update did not work. When wiped and unpacked old maps they worked.


fujixpro
Posts: 53
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2017 7:30 pm
Location: cumbernauld

Re: New maps

Post by fujixpro » Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:28 am

What's all the fuss about new maps,many of us old farts that have been on the road for a few years find it laughable at some forms of technology, sat nav can be a right pain in the BUM, well how many of you have been taken to where you did not want to be, always carry an old style map with you folks.


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pch
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:05 pm

Re: New maps

Post by pch » Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:41 am

fujixpro wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:28 am
What's all the fuss about new maps,many of us old farts that have been on the road for a few years find it laughable at some forms of technology, sat nav can be a right pain in the BUM, well how many of you have been taken to where you did not want to be, always carry an old style map with you folks.
Sure fujixpro. No problem at all.
Sorry, but your opinion does not add anything constructive to the problem of updating maps.You still have the same discussion about differences between H4 headlights over LED - you still can see the road right? I didn't ask for advice whether to get one feature or not.

No offence here but when I paid for updates I want to have it updated. Full stop. Just asking other forum members if they experienced the same issues and how to fix them.

Again - no offence here but if you don't have anything positive to add - you can just ignore this thread.


loffler
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 7:52 pm

Re: New maps

Post by loffler » Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:44 pm

Correct, mapcare is not itself private or secure, anyone can download the maps (I did last week). The security is on the SD card (SD stands for Secure Digital after all)
CID is part of the SD specification. Its not a file or something else on a partition, its hard coded to each cards registry and is unique. The old RNS315 systems also had a locking password generated which locked it down even more than the MIB2 cards.

I don't know what is different between a mapcare and a non-mapcare SD card, but when paired with the car, an encrypted file is made that links the car to the CID. I'm guessing that in the UK this can only be done once and when you overwrite the files you destroy that relationship. Mapcare cards maybe has other time or usage restriction for number of times this can be written.
Going through ETKA, there are at least 5 SD cards with western Europe maps on. I would speculate that the maps are the same but the security and abilities are different.

If you want to do more reading on it, look up Richard Burtons CID project and related posts on seatcupra.net. There is a lot of information out there already.
Jungle Green 1.4 EcoTSi DSG Xcellence
Heated Windscreen and Virtual Pedal
Ordered 3rd Feb - Delivered 24th Apr


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pch
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:05 pm

Re: New maps

Post by pch » Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:57 pm

That makes sense - it looks like car stores the ID of SD card with a map.
If the card is secure it should not allow to write data on protected card.

This explains why they advice to use the same card for updates so wiping should not delete this relationship.

And I can confirm that:
1) New maps data on the same card did not work
2) Old maps data on the same card worked - but data was from previously downloaded seat updates (not from backup). In the mean time I compared content of files and backup was 100% match to downloaded files.

All above is good to know but my issue remains unsolved - I've downloaded new maps and they didn't work (even from original card).
loffler wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:44 pm
anyone can download the maps (I did last week)
Do you mean you have installed and it works?


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