1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

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Lin
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:27 pm

1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Lin » Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:54 pm

I plan to keep my car for at least 5 years and I wonder if choosing a 1.4/1.5 DSG Ateca will be a good idea. I am wondering if I need to worry about a dry clutch with start stop raffic.

Some of my car journeys can have a lot of start stop traffic ie: stuck in queues edging forward a few feet - stop - edge forward a few feet - stop - and repeat for sometimes quite a while. Will this sort of driving be an issue for the dry clutch DSG? I noticed in the online owners manual it mentions the gearbox could overheat and cause damage?
"In certain driving situations or traffic conditions, such as frequently starting, prolonged "creeping" of the vehicle or traffic jams with continuous stoppages, the gearbox could overheat causing damage! If the warning lamp lights up, stop the vehicle as soon as possible and wait for the gearbox to cool"

I have always owned manual cars and borrowed an automatic car a few times about 10 years ago but it wasn't a DSG, so I haven't any experience or knowledge about DSG gearbox.


AlasdairMac
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Location: West Lothian

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by AlasdairMac » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:22 pm

In situations like that I turn the auto stop off. That should eliminate any stress on the gearbox.
Ateca 2.0 TDi 190 Xcellence DSG 4Drive Sunroof, Black.


Fred99
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Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Fred99 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:27 pm

What do you mean by auto stop? Autohold or start stop or what?

Some people say that’s when you should use neutral.
1.4TSI DSG Xcellence delivered 2/3/17 after 6 months wait. Brilliant Silver. 18" machined alloys. Park Assist. 360º cameras. Power boot. All driver assists. Alcantara. SEAT sound.


Flakmunky
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Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Flakmunky » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:09 pm

Auto start/stop (where the engine stops and restarts) will not put any stress on the clutch.

My understanding is that starting and stopping in traffic will not put any stress on the clutch as long as the clutch is fully engaged when you are moving.

The DSG is an automated manual gearbox. Riding the clutch in a DSG will cause premature wear and make it overheat, just as it would in a manual.

How do you ride the clutch in a DSG when you don't have a clutch pedal?!

If the car is moving (forwards or backwards) on 'tickover' or faster then the clutch is fully engaged. There will be no unnecessary friction or premature wear. When the car is held (at a standstill) on the foot brake then the clutch is fully disengaged and there will again be no unnecessary friction or premature wear.

Where premature wear will occur is when you 'cover' the foot brake so that the car moves slower than it would on tickover. This is the equivalent of riding the clutch in a manual as the clutch will be partially disengaged. This is what your quote from the manual refers to as 'creeping'.

In traffic, if you take your foot completely off the brake when the traffic moves and then when it stops you also come to a complete stop with your foot firmly on the brake (as opposed to creeping along at a slower-than-tickover-speed by partially pressing the brake pedal) you will be fine. The auto-hold helps greatly in this regard, as does stop/start (as no wear can occur with the engine off).

The above is based on internet research and personal experience of owning and driving a 2007 Leon 2.0 FR TFSI DSG and now my Ateca. The Leon was a dry clutch, 6 speed DSG, my Ateca is a 7 speed wet clutch.

NOTE: Covering the brake will only cause premature wear at slower than tickover crawling speeds. Covering the brake when driving at speed does not cause premature wear as the engine speed will adjust accordingly, just as in a manual.

In Eco, the DSG will disengage the clutch when you remove your foot from the accelerator and will coast. There is no engine braking. If you cover the brake, the clutch will re-engage and you will get engine braking.

EDIT: This is a good summary...



HTH!
Xcellence 2.0 TDI 190 DSG 4Drive in Lava Blue with:
Digital Cockpit, Top View, Park Assist & Advanced Comfort & Driving Pack Plus 2


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Paul.Cambs
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Location: Cambridgeshire

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Paul.Cambs » Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:54 pm

Thanks Flakmunky for that...it was quite interesting to read what was going on under the bonnet and how best to help look after it too :-)
'Samantha' is a Feb-2018 Samoa FR 2.0 TSi 4Drive DSG
19" Wheels | KESSY | Power Tailgate | Adaptive Cruise | Top View Camera | Seat Sound
Convenience Pack | Winter Pack | Advanced Comfort and Driving Plus Pack | Heated Front Screen


Tet70
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Location: Finland

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Tet70 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 7:46 am

One correction:
Flakmunky wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:09 pm
The Leon was a dry clutch, 6 speed DSG, my Ateca is a 7 speed wet clutch.
6-speed DSG has never been produced with dry clutches. It's always a wet clutch version.
Jungle Green 1.4 TSI 4Drive DSG Style + quite a lot of extras. Delivered in less than 8 months. :roll:


Flakmunky
Posts: 195
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Flakmunky » Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:45 pm

Yep, you're right and I knew that so not sure where I pulled that from!
Xcellence 2.0 TDI 190 DSG 4Drive in Lava Blue with:
Digital Cockpit, Top View, Park Assist & Advanced Comfort & Driving Pack Plus 2


Fred99
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Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 5:11 pm
Location: Granada, Spain

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Fred99 » Fri Jul 20, 2018 1:58 pm

I think they call that a "Trumpian Slip"! :D :D
1.4TSI DSG Xcellence delivered 2/3/17 after 6 months wait. Brilliant Silver. 18" machined alloys. Park Assist. 360º cameras. Power boot. All driver assists. Alcantara. SEAT sound.


Flakmunky
Posts: 195
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Flakmunky » Fri Jul 20, 2018 2:37 pm

Haha! I think you're right! Can't believe he said what he did!
Xcellence 2.0 TDI 190 DSG 4Drive in Lava Blue with:
Digital Cockpit, Top View, Park Assist & Advanced Comfort & Driving Pack Plus 2


Lin
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:27 pm

Re: 1.4 & 1.5 DSG in traffic

Post by Lin » Fri Jul 20, 2018 4:43 pm

Flakmunky wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:09 pm
Auto start/stop (where the engine stops and restarts) will not put any stress on the clutch.

My understanding is that starting and stopping in traffic will not put any stress on the clutch as long as the clutch is fully engaged when you are moving.

The DSG is an automated manual gearbox. Riding the clutch in a DSG will cause premature wear and make it overheat, just as it would in a manual.

How do you ride the clutch in a DSG when you don't have a clutch pedal?!

If the car is moving (forwards or backwards) on 'tickover' or faster then the clutch is fully engaged. There will be no unnecessary friction or premature wear. When the car is held (at a standstill) on the foot brake then the clutch is fully disengaged and there will again be no unnecessary friction or premature wear.

Where premature wear will occur is when you 'cover' the foot brake so that the car moves slower than it would on tickover. This is the equivalent of riding the clutch in a manual as the clutch will be partially disengaged. This is what your quote from the manual refers to as 'creeping'.

In traffic, if you take your foot completely off the brake when the traffic moves and then when it stops you also come to a complete stop with your foot firmly on the brake (as opposed to creeping along at a slower-than-tickover-speed by partially pressing the brake pedal) you will be fine. The auto-hold helps greatly in this regard, as does stop/start (as no wear can occur with the engine off).

The above is based on internet research and personal experience of owning and driving a 2007 Leon 2.0 FR TFSI DSG and now my Ateca. The Leon was a dry clutch, 6 speed DSG, my Ateca is a 7 speed wet clutch.

NOTE: Covering the brake will only cause premature wear at slower than tickover crawling speeds. Covering the brake when driving at speed does not cause premature wear as the engine speed will adjust accordingly, just as in a manual.

In Eco, the DSG will disengage the clutch when you remove your foot from the accelerator and will coast. There is no engine braking. If you cover the brake, the clutch will re-engage and you will get engine braking.
Thankyou very much for that info Flakmunky!

Flakmunky wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:09 pm
EDIT: This is a good summary...



HTH!
Thank you. Will check out the YouTube video when I get WiFi later. Just had a quick scan through some of the comments it seems a lot of them are not a fan of DSG lol.

When you say "Where premature wear will occur is when you 'cover' the foot brake so that the car moves slower than it would on tickover. This is the equivalent of riding the clutch in a manual as the clutch will be partially disengaged. This is what your quote from the manual refers to as 'creeping'."
Does that mean when the car moves forward or backward without me pressing the accelerator pedal? If so, then that is what could wear out the clutch/overheat the gearbox but when I test drove a 1.5 DSG I struggled to reverse using the accelerator pedal, I found it made the car move back too fast if I used the accelerator pedal even with only a gentle foot, it was just a bit too fast for my liking. When I let it "creep" backward in reverse gear (so my foot was not on the accelerator at all) I had to keep applying the brake on and off to do parallel parking, or to reverse in or out of my driveway for example.

I also noticed when I pulled off from a complete stop the car changed into 2nd gear within only a few seconds. In heavy slow moving traffic I should imagine this will not be a good thing as clutch will be slipping with changing to 2nd so quickly and then me stopping only seconds later when the traffic has stopped moving again.

I found it a pleasant drive I really enjoyed it. So much more enjoyable than manual. But I have seen a lot of comments on forums warning against dry clutch DSG's so cannot make up my mind whether to go for it or not.


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